I am convinced that Stephenie could be talked into setting herself on fire. She has no ability to think for herself!

I didn't take Rafe's actions as jealously. I looked at it more as if he couldn't believe someone wouldn't think of others first. Not that I necessarily agree with him, but that was how he thinks.

Rafe has been playing brilliantly and I did appreciate the fact that Rafe realized that he is just different than the other players, since he immediately thought 'why wouldn't I want to give everyone a car!' I didn't think it was gamemanship on his part either. I honestly believe that is how he is in real life.

Todd at December 9, 2005 11:07 AM

Todd, we aren't talking a sandwich here. I agree that Rafe is a nice guy who would probably, in the real world, give something (like a sandwich) to someone else rather than keep it for himself. His jealousy over the car thing was just that, jealousy. He wanted a car, didn't win it, saw a second chance in Cindy's choice (not to mention they practically had him drooling by driving them out) and got jealous when he didn't get it. You would too! Nobody is that selfless. Rafe is all noble and stuff about giving cars away when the choice isn't his, and he would receive one.

AND he was laying it on really thick.

I have been rooting for Steph the whole time, but am starting to swing to Danni, I think. I guess I like the whole underdog thing. I'd still be okay if Rafe won it too.

Jeremy at December 9, 2005 11:14 AM

Why is Lydia still there?

Sara at December 9, 2005 11:18 AM

I thought Steph hit the nail on the head when she said Rafe likes to play the martyr just a little bit. I don't believe for a second Rafe is completely selfless. He's human too. While I believe he is generally a sweet man who does think of others first, I find his begrudgement of Cindy who earned the car rather heavy-handed. He felt entitled to the car somehow and felt cheated when Cindy made her choice. Orchestrating the vote against her basically because she didn't give him a car smacked of jealousy to me.

Personally, I don't know what I would do. I am afraid of the car curse. I am also afraid of getting voted out immediately. I might have given up the car in fear of being voted out if I didn't.

I don't know who I'm rooting for. I guess I'm okay with anyone winning except Lydia. I'm still partial to Rafe, I think.

Maggie at December 9, 2005 11:19 AM

Matthew from The Amazon gave up a reward, time with his mother, so that his tribemates could have family visits instead. He was rewarded for his generosity by having time with his mother anyway. I wonder if Cindy would have been allowed to keep the car if she gave it away.


Maggie at December 9, 2005 11:27 AM

I was wondering about that, but I doubt it... this year survivor seems a bit bitchier! :) The food/immunity challenge where if you wanted to eat you couldn't compete, and then with the family visits...normally the family members who don't get to stay at least get to hug and say hi. This year they just waved "bye bye, smell ya later"

(I would have kept the car.. well not *that* car it's YOOOOOOGE)

Soosan at December 9, 2005 11:31 AM

I just don't think it was jealously. I don't know why either. I really think he would given up the car so everyone could have one.

Todd at December 9, 2005 11:47 AM

I didn't think it had anything to do with jealosy or for that matter about the curse. I would have given the car up for the simple reason that you are playing the game to win $1 million, not a $25,000 car - giving it up would have made the 4 people who have the power to vote you out very happy. Taking the car made them unhappy. The final 5 gets paid like $70 - $90,000 anyway, for every additional episode you last, you get like $5k more. Giving up the car would have given her at least until the final four and probably the final three. Bonehead move by Cindy and natural reaction by Rafe.

aw at December 9, 2005 12:29 PM

I soooo ditto everything that aw said. Cindy was not thinking strategically. She could buy a better car if she stuck around. She said there are no guarantees in Survivor which is true, but the odds are on your side that you will be around for at least a few more votes if you give everyone a car. Instead of thinking big picture, she was blinded by a shiny car. The so called "curse" is really about drawing too much attention (and maybe some jealous ire)to the player who wins the car, thus causing them to ge voted out.

Pammysue at December 9, 2005 12:39 PM

Couple of thoughts based on all the great comments here...

1) Great twist with the "option to get rid of the car curse."

2) Anyone who said they would have "no question" given away the car is lying out their piehole. Cindy handled it poorly, but I believe each and everyone of them would have kept theirs is everyone thought everyone would get a car but them.

3) No one on Survivor has ever benefitted long term by sacrificing for the group (see: Matthew). Although please prove me wrong if I am.

4) Winning the car means a) you're a 'uuuge threat as a competitor in the end or b) you got lucky and have been compensated aplenty by walking out with a car. Either case, an almost guilt-free excuse to vote you out. Which is why it's a curse.

Janet at December 9, 2005 12:54 PM

Yes, but these things can be exclusive of each other. Cindy *was* a total bonehead for keeping the car...she would have been less of a target as it turned out. That doesn't mean Rafe was any less jealous. He retaliated against her for not giving him a car. He told the camera he was going to do that, and he did.

I'm not going to argue about whether the curse of the car is a real curse. I think calling it a curse is just an easy way of saying, "you take that car, you're screwed." Mystical forces don't screw you, the other survivors do.

On Big Brother a couple of seasons back, one woman screwed over her housemates on the first night by accepting something like $30,000. I thought she was going home that night but she ended up winning the whole shebang.

Maggie at December 9, 2005 12:55 PM

Janet, you read my mind one minute before me!

Maggie at December 9, 2005 12:56 PM

Sara, you're not a lone voice crying in the wilderness.

Why Is Lydia still there? Why?

luscious loulou at December 9, 2005 12:59 PM

Because lydia is a crazy dancing machine!

Soosan at December 9, 2005 01:02 PM

Because every final 4 needs their "older under the radar woman."

Janet at December 9, 2005 02:25 PM

Gotta agree with aw on this one. The clear strategic choice was to sacrifice your car. I think Rafe recognized that as did Danni. Lydia was too dumb to do so.

Stephenie and Cindy, however, were overly influenced by the fact that they don't own a car. They didn't think strategically -- which is fine. She should be thrilled she got a car.

I'll have to watch again, but I had no thought at all about Rafe being jealous until I read Maggie's comments.

yahtzee at December 9, 2005 02:26 PM

Lydia is still there because she's not a threat, and because anybody in the final two is more likely to win the vote over her than to win over any other opponent. So why vote her off ahead of stronger competition?

John at December 9, 2005 04:06 PM

alls i'm sayin' is there is no guaranteeing Rafe still wouldn't have plotted against Cindy had she given him [them] a car. it's not like any of them [or any of us, for that matter] would have thought "oh, she gave me a car, now i CAN'T vote her off the island." yeah right.

if i never hear that "ridin' around in my automobile" song again it will be too soon.

sar at December 9, 2005 07:24 PM

Rafe did say to the camera that if Cindy had given them all a car, he didn't think he would have been able to vote for her at Tribal Council. Of course, he can say what he would have done until he's blue in the face... we'll never know since he wasn't put in that position.

I'm sure Rafe was a little jealous but I didn't read it as jealousy when I was watching it so much as just awe that everyone isn't completely selfless.

Personally, I would have given up the car in a heartbeat because 1.) I didn't care much for that car 2.) I've owned a brand new car and I was only making about $24,000 a year when I bought it (so why is owning a new car something that Cindy couldn't imagine ever doing? She's a zookeeper, right? So she has a solid job?) 3.) Because I automatically would have assumed that I would have gotten one in return for my generosity. After all, there were five cars. They didn't drive out three new ones - they drove out four new ones. Of course, that assumption would have probably come back to bite me in the ass!

Cheri at December 9, 2005 08:23 PM

Good observation...I didn't notice that. 5 cars. Hmmm. I wish there was some way to know for sure!

Maggie at December 9, 2005 09:11 PM

I figured they would have surprised her with one at the reunion show.

freakgirl at December 9, 2005 09:50 PM

Um . . . Lydia is here because she EARNED it? By not winning any reward or immunity challenges at all (except for when there were still two tribes), she didn't look like a threat at all, and not looking like a threat in challenges is the surefire way of getting far in the game. In fact, I want either her or Danni to win. Even if Rafe is of the same . . . orientation . . . as I am, I don't want him to win after that reaction to Cindy not giving anyone else cars.

Jamison at December 9, 2005 11:46 PM
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